Polls for Apr 15: Media #6 / Coaches #7 / USALAX #12

[OrangeXtreme]

https://www.insidelacrosse.com/article/men-s-di-media-poll-no-1-notre-dame-is-unanimous-and-battle-tested/63096

Notre Dame continues to be battle-tested. Now, they are unanimous No. 1 in the Inside Lacrosse Media Poll.

This weekend it was an 18-17 win against Cornell, and week after week the Irish are taking down top opponents with Duke and Syracuse the weeks prior. The Irish have North Carolina and Virginia up next before the ACC Tournament.

Duke is No. 2 after continuing its improbable regular season streak against Virginia in decisive fashion. Johns Hopkins needed OT to beat Ohio State, and the Jays come in at No. 3, ahead of the Cavaliers and Maryland.

Denver rose a few spots to No. 7 after its Top 10 win against Georgetown.

The real intrigue is in the back half of the Top 20. Towson, Richmond and Saint Joseph’s are steadily putting up wins — and as a result they collectively moved up to 14, 15 and 16 in the poll. Delaware is back in the Top 20 after a CAA win against Stony Brook.

Check out the full IL Media Poll here.

Rank	Team	Points	Prev
1	Notre Dame (8 - 1)	500 (25)	1
2	Duke (11 - 3)	465	4
3	Johns Hopkins (9 - 3)	442	3
4	Virginia (10 - 2)	420	2
5	Maryland (8 - 3)	389	5
6	Syracuse (10 - 4)	354	7

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Small Shuffle Near Top of USA Lacrosse Division I Men's Top 20

Notre Dame and Johns Hopkins survived while Duke thrived against Virginia.

www.usalacrosse.com

USA LACROSSE DIVISION I MEN’S TOP 20​

1. Notre Dame, 8-1 (Prev: 1)
2. Duke, 11-3 (Prev: 4)
3. Johns Hopkins, 9-3 (Prev: 3)
4. Virginia, 10-2 (Prev: 2)
5. Maryland, 8-3 (Prev: 6)
6. Denver, 9-2 (Prev: 9)
7. Penn State, 8-3 (Prev: 7)
8. Yale, 9-2 (Prev: 8)
9. Georgetown, 8-3 (Prev: 5)
10. Cornell, 7-4 (Prev: 10)
11. Army, 9-2 (Prev: 11)
12. Syracuse, 10-4 (Prev: 12)
13. Penn, 8-4 (Prev: 13)
14. Richmond, 8-4 (Prev: 17)
15. Towson, 9-3 (Prev: 19)
16. Saint Joseph’s, 8-3 (Prev: NR)
17. Delaware, 7-3 (Prev: NR)
18. Princeton, 7-4 (Prev: 14)
19. Harvard, 7-4 (Prev: 18)
20. Colgate, 7-5 (Prev: 16)

Also considered (alphabetical order): Boston U (7-5), Michigan (6-6), Navy (7-5), North Carolina (6-6), Ohio State (6-7), Rutgers (7-5)

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Quint Kessenich’s Top 20: April 15th, 2024

My Top 20 presented by SPIRE Lacrosse, always a treacherous exercise. Quint Kessenich's Top 20 presented by Spire 1) Notre Dame In front of 7480 fans at | NCAA, Ranking

laxallstars.com

7) Syracuse​

#HHH staggered to the finish line in a 10-9 victory at North Carolina, in front of a sparse crowd in Chapel Hill, clinching a spot in the four team ACC tourney. That’s the good news.

SU’s last goal came with 9:34 left in 3rd quarter. That’s the bad news.

Orange in the 4th quarter committed seven turnovers with 0 goals and 2 blown clears while playing with a multi-goal lead.

Positives were: Billy Dwan III scored again. Joey Spallina was (1,5). The middies can really pass. For Otto it was nearly a replay of the Cornell debacle. Game management sold separately. OC Pat March watched on ESPN+. SU Clock and score intellect not up to par. How about valuing the ball? How about backing up shots?

Saturday 2 PM on ESPNU check out Virginia at Syracuse in the Dome.

 

[DoctahLexus]

Quint Kessenich’s Top 20: April 15th, 2024

My Top 20 presented by SPIRE Lacrosse, always a treacherous exercise. Quint Kessenich's Top 20 presented by Spire 1) Notre Dame In front of 7480 fans at | NCAA, Ranking

laxallstars.com

7) Syracuse​

#HHH staggered to the finish line in a 10-9 victory at North Carolina, in front of a sparse crowd in Chapel Hill, clinching a spot in the four team ACC tourney. That’s the good news.

SU’s last goal came with 9:34 left in 3rd quarter. That’s the bad news.

Orange in the 4th quarter committed seven turnovers with 0 goals and 2 blown clears while playing with a multi-goal lead.

Positives were: Billy Dwan III scored again. Joey Spallina was (1,5). The middies can really pass. For Otto it was nearly a replay of the Cornell debacle. Game management sold separately. OC Pat March watched on ESPN+. SU Clock and score intellect not up to par. How about valuing the ball? How about backing up shots?

Saturday 2 PM on ESPNU check out Virginia at Syracuse in the Dome.

"Game management sold separately" "Clock and score intellect not up to par" Again I will accept we had guys making undisciplined plays and coaching is on some level a factor there, but our actual game management/clock and score awareness was not even that bad. Our offense was missing shots, committing turnovers, or getting stopped by Krieg on good looks. Our defense was playing well but blew a couple clears. Does that make our clock/game management bad? He is clearly trying to put something on our coaches. What was the actual dumb move that our coaches made? Lazy comments from Quint. Players making dumb decisions or errors does not mean the clock and game management was poor from the coaches.

 

[LaxAddict38]

"Game management sold separately" "Clock and score intellect not up to par" Again I will accept we had guys making undisciplined plays and coaching is on some level a factor there, but our actual game management/clock and score awareness was not even that bad. Our offense was missing shots, committing turnovers, or getting stopped by Krieg on good looks. Our defense was playing well but blew a couple clears. Does that make our clock/game management bad? He is clearly trying to put something on our coaches. What was the actual dumb move that our coaches made? Lazy comments from Quint. Players making dumb decisions or errors does not mean the clock and game management was poor from the coaches.

I think the criticism is less of coaches on game day vs. coaches in practice (fall, pre-season, etc.).

Idea being that, early in the year, players should be coached on how to handle late game situations with discipline and IQ, and it can come to the surface in these situations later on in the season.

I agree, on game day I’m not sure what adjustments can be made other than “put the ball in the goal when you shoot” in the 3rd and 4th. Maybe some adjustments to the clear? Pull an attackman over the midline? Not Quint’s best work imo.

 

[DoctahLexus]

I think the criticism is less of coaches on game day vs. coaches in practice (fall, pre-season, etc.).

Idea being that, early in the year, players should be coached on how to handle late game situations with discipline and IQ, and it can come to the surface in these situations later on in the season.

I agree, on game day I’m not sure what adjustments can be made other than “put the ball in the goal when you shoot” in the 3rd and 4th. Maybe some adjustments to the clear? Pull an attackman over the midline? Not Quint’s best work imo.

If he worded it like that I would have way less of a problem with it. Looking back the truly horrendous play from a game clock management perspective was the Olexo shot with clearly no back up, but again it should not take a coach reiterating that in practice or yelling out from the sideline for a 4 year player to not take that shot. He had Spallina and Mule yelling at him to pass it instead as well. Olexo is better than that in year 4 and he knows it. Maybe Quint is on to something if the players and staff were showing signs of encouraging a shot like that, but that is simply not the case.

 

[DoctahLexus]

The amount of different people devoted to hating on Cuse is beyond insane. Fanlax cuse page is literally just different people on a broken record saying the team is trash. Literally every team this year has had bad losses or bad performances. Somehow we are the only who are completely defined by ours, meanwhile we also have two top 5 wins but who cares about those. Cannot wait until we silence all these losers in the post season.

 

[FloridaCuse]

The amount of different people devoted to hating on Cuse is beyond insane. Fanlax cuse page is literally just different people on a broken record saying the team is trash. Literally every team this year has had bad losses or bad performances. Somehow we are the only who are completely defined by ours, meanwhile we also have two top 5 wins but who cares about those. Cannot wait until we silence all these losers in the post season.

Unfortunately when we've had the success we've had over the years some of the hating comes with the territory. One interpretation is that they'll all jeolous of our past success and will be again when we achieve it in the future. GO ORANGE!!!

 

[MD Cuse Fan]

The amount of different people devoted to hating on Cuse is beyond insane. Fanlax cuse page is literally just different people on a broken record saying the team is trash. Literally every team this year has had bad losses or bad performances. Somehow we are the only who are completely defined by ours, meanwhile we also have two top 5 wins but who cares about those. Cannot wait until we silence all these losers in the post season.

Yeah spending less and less time over there, cant get much good conversation on the team. Like you say it's turned into nothing more than posters constantly crapping on Spallina or taking shots at the program. Some of those people really need to get a hobby.

 

[DoctahLexus]

Yeah spending less and less time over there, cant get much good conversation on the team. Like you say it's turned into nothing more than posters constantly crapping on Spallina or taking shots at the program. Some of those people really need to get a hobby.

Ugh. All true. Don't even know why I look over there to be honest. They had to pivot from Spallina after he put up 13 points in the last two games. Will just make it more fun when we do well this postseason

 

[fieldystick]

Somehow we are the only who are completely defined by ours, meanwhile we also have two top 5 wins but who cares about those.

*raises hand* I care about those.

My opinion is that Syracuse has things (maybe several things) to work on, but all teams do.

I think the people who think Notre Dame stands alone and on a direct path to hoisting the championship trophy are not really watching these teams play. Notre Dame might very well be the favorite, but they are not 2022 Maryland - not even close.

I believe that Johns Hopkins could beat Notre Dame or any other team in the country, for that matter. I really believe in the potential of this team... But, I also witnessed them lose to Navy, and barely beat Ohio State just last night, so there you go. Just get in and have your house in order when you get there, and you have a chance. It's pretty simple.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[tbonezone]

swap spots with the CAV's with a W.

 

[PhatOrange]

Quint back to his old self. How do you 'stagger' to the finish line when you're down 3 or 4 zip to start the game. To me, that's a come back win and the holding on. It's not easy on the road, showing some moxy to never be out of the fight and a win is galvanizing.

I love that he has 3 big 10 teams in the top 6. eye roll. Yale, Cornell and Army are better than all 3 imo.

 

[fieldystick]

I love that he has 3 big 10 teams in the top 6. eye roll. Yale, Cornell and Army are better than all 3 imo.

You cannot be serious. If you think Army should be ranked ahead of Hopkins right now - the most lopsided of these 9 comparisons - I don't know what to tell you.

We're either looking at different things or highly value different things. If you have a ranking system that solely values head-to-head results versus Navy and Syracuse and nothing else, sure, I'll buy Army over Hopkins.

Penn State literally beat Cornell by double digits by the way. I think all three Big Ten teams ahead of the three teams you mentioned would be the broad consensus right now with maybe 1 or 2 of those teams clipping PSU according to some... but then again, PSU does have direct head to head so... hmm.

 

[JeremyCuse]

"Game management sold separately" "Clock and score intellect not up to par" Again I will accept we had guys making undisciplined plays and coaching is on some level a factor there, but our actual game management/clock and score awareness was not even that bad. Our offense was missing shots, committing turnovers, or getting stopped by Krieg on good looks. Our defense was playing well but blew a couple clears. Does that make our clock/game management bad? He is clearly trying to put something on our coaches. What was the actual dumb move that our coaches made? Lazy comments from Quint. Players making dumb decisions or errors does not mean the clock and game management was poor from the coaches.

Not sure he's putting the full onus or even most of it on the coaching staff to be honest. I think he was pointing out that SU in the 4th quarter was making dumb mistakes you simply can't have.

Whether its the staff or players I think his point was spot on. As he noted "Orange in the 4th quarter committed seven turnovers with 0 goals and 2 blown clears while playing with a multi-goal lead." This is the second game in a row where SU was a complete sh&t show in the 4th quarter and it nearly cost them both games and probably would have if there was another minute on the clock Saturday.

I think it would be a mistake to just kind of chalk up the performance from 9 min to go in the third on as some bad luck or a one off when we just saw the exact same thing happen versus Cornell. Whether its on the coaches or players or some combo of both this team has to play better late and stop making the same mistakes over and over. I tend to put more of the fault on the offense and clearing game then the defense. Some of the stuff we saw in the 4th was ridiculous and by guys who should absolutely know better. Zero goals in the last nearly 25 mins of game play is crazy especially when you consider UNC was missing it's best pole and not dominating at the X.

This team ahs the talent to make a serious run in the tournament and I fear its inability to play a complete game will cost it big time.

 

[PhatOrange]

You cannot be serious. If you think Army should be ranked ahead of Hopkins right now - the most lopsided of these 9 comparisons - I don't know what to tell you.

We're either looking at different things or highly value different things. If you have a ranking system that solely values head-to-head results versus Navy and Syracuse and nothing else, sure, I'll buy Army over Hopkins.

Penn State literally beat Cornell by double digits by the way. I think all three Big Ten teams ahead of the three teams you mentioned would be the broad consensus right now with maybe 1 or 2 of those teams clipping PSU according to some... but then again, PSU does have direct head to head so... hmm.

Broad consensus? The coaches have Cornell and Yale in the top 10 ahead of Penn State and Army 2 spots behind in a couple of polls. Not that much of a stretch. All 3 big ten teams have bad losses.

 

[DoctahLexus]

Not sure he's putting the full onus or even most of it on the coaching staff to be honest. I think he was pointing out that SU in the 4th quarter was making dumb mistakes you simply can't have.

Whether its the staff or players I think his point was spot on. As he noted "Orange in the 4th quarter committed seven turnovers with 0 goals and 2 blown clears while playing with a multi-goal lead." This is the second game in a row where SU was a complete sh&t show in the 4th quarter and it nearly cost them both games and probably would have if there was another minute on the clock Saturday.

I think it would be a mistake to just kind of chalk up the performance from 9 min to go in the third on as some bad luck or a one off when we just saw the exact same thing happen versus Cornell. Whether its on the coaches or players or some combo of both this team has to play better late and stop making the same mistakes over and over. I tend to put more of the fault on the offense and clearing game then the defense. Some of the stuff we saw in the 4th was ridiculous and by guys who should absolutely know better. Zero goals in the last nearly 25 mins of game play is crazy especially when you consider UNC was missing it's best pole and not dominating at the X.

This team ahs the talent to make a serious run in the tournament and I fear its inability to play a complete game will cost it big time.

It is more than bad luck, but man the autopsy on both those games they are still getting some of the same looks they were getting earlier in the game and either missing or getting stuffed by the goalie. I just can’t shake that one or two more fall in each of those games and the narrative totally changes. Part of the lack of goals is also attempting to run the clock due to a large lead, which we build by having a long stretch of quality offense. It is possible that strategy in general is doing more harm than good for the flow of the offense later in games.

I don’t think it’s bad luck, but some of these shots late have to start falling because for the most part they are not getting shut down late in games, just not finding the back of the net.

 

[cuselaxss26]

I know it won’t happen but i’d like to see early in game giving some young mids a chance. Maby even have hottle run little with his speed i’m sure he can beat his guy to draw a slide or mccarthy. Who from what i seen is a shoot on run type mid. Also may be stretch here but if we’re to take mulé out and give anyone a shot i’d like to see tenaglia. He’s roughly bout same size as mule but little faster n has better shot in limited time seen him shoot. Give anyone who will want to prove or has been battling for time for while. Mulé has his moments but also has bad moments. Him not being able to beat a dmid is just killer tho. Can always invert leo when he’s on so don’t need him at attack. Think also at end of games besides offense slowing down also think some tiredness in there. As we run same guys non stop and english and stevens play alot more then O at times also. Can throw third mid line in there once in while as said prob earlier in game or as do with cacameo and Kol. Switch 1-2 mids thru out also. Throw kellogg once or twice mccarthy n as said even hottle. Yes he’s doing decent job at dmid but he also is offense guy n has speed. At end of games can use speed guy to beat his man n draw slides get d moving. I don’t know feel we just need to find a spark or chance something specially at end of games def if leading.

 

[cuselaxss26]

With the schedule we had n games so close almost felt should have used few more guys on both ends. Not only gets them experience but prevents some ware on our main guys. Would made more sense earlier in season then now of course. Felt since that ND game dudes were just tired. Grant don’t see the “hustle “ think we need to play with some may call it “heart”. Just watching this past cornell game n even hopkins game. Like at crunch time these teams turn on a second gear n it’s just go go go go. Not saying has to be a chaotic pace or anything but have pep in ur step every second of every qtr n game. I just don’t see that bunch from our guys. Yes have speedy guys sure helps or make it look that way. But feel times they’re just to mellow body wise but mentally all over place when needs to be other way around. Hopefully come out ready vs uva and start playing to full potential cause don’t think seen it yet.

 

[ClvrUsrnm]

If only there was a tournament to decide who is better than whom …

 

[Powellfan]

It is more than bad luck, but man the autopsy on both those games they are still getting some of the same looks they were getting earlier in the game and either missing or getting stuffed by the goalie. I just can’t shake that one or two more fall in each of those games and the narrative totally changes. Part of the lack of goals is also attempting to run the clock due to a large lead, which we build by having a long stretch of quality offense. It is possible that strategy in general is doing more harm than good for the flow of the offense later in games.

I don’t think it’s bad luck, but some of these shots late have to start falling because for the most part they are not getting shut down late in games, just not finding the back of the net.

Were they getting the same looks? The fourth quarter stats for the UNC game were pretty bad -

Shots - UNC +6
SOGs - UNC +6
Turnovers - SU +3
Groundballs - UNC +6
Face-offs - even at 2 a piece
Saves - SU +3

SU had just five shots in the entire fourth quarter (12 in the third) and just two were on goal. That's not going to win you many games. Yes, I understand trying to milk the clock, but they still needed to do a better job of finishing the ball when they had it.

I think UNC went to a 10 man ride which seemed to disrupt the SU flow - with a 10 man ride it encourages opposing teams to go to goal and I think there was a disconnect on the field of what exactly to do (the bad Olexo shot). Syracuse probably wanted to hold the ball for longer stretches, but UNC wanted them to take quick shots. This seemed to trip them up. They definintly need to practice these end of game situations better. You can feel the team tighten up through the TV screen when watching them - with one regular season game to go it's a big question of whether they can turn this around.

 

[DoctahLexus]

Were they getting the same looks? The fourth quarter stats for the UNC game were pretty bad -

Shots - UNC +6
SOGs - UNC +6
Turnovers - SU +3
Groundballs - UNC +6
Face-offs - even at 2 a piece
Saves - SU +3

SU had just five shots in the entire fourth quarter (12 in the third) and just two were on goal. That's not going to win you many games. Yes, I understand trying to milk the clock, but they still needed to do a better job of finishing the ball when they had it.

I think UNC went to a 10 man ride which seemed to disrupt the SU flow - with a 10 man ride it encourages opposing teams to go to goal and I think there was a disconnect on the field of what exactly to do (the bad Olexo shot). Syracuse probably wanted to hold the ball for longer stretches, but UNC wanted them to take quick shots. This seemed to trip them up. They definintly need to practice these end of game situations better. You can feel the team tighten up through the TV screen when watching them - with one regular season game to go it's a big question of whether they can turn this around.

When the offense actually had a legit possession the looks at cage were quality. From when it hit 10-4 and onward in the third we were still getting quality scoring opportunities. After 10-4 our next couple possessions we had several looks at cage where we either smoked the finish, or got stuffed by Krieg. It is a miracle we did not land another goal later in the third quarter when you watch the tape. Mule got stuffed on the crease or hit the pipe like 4 times in 2 possessions. We were shelling Kreig.

4th quarter the clock was moving a lot faster. Stats show we failed two clears, but it was actually more like 4 since one time we turned it over shortly after getting over half field and another was the infamous Olexo shot. UNC had some long possessions as well, including a full clock followed by a man up opportunity, and a shot clock violation when we went into zone. We had only 3-4 legit offensive possessions and in those we had Thomson whiff an easy finish on the crease, Birtwistle get stuffed by Krieg on a quality shot from the middle of the field. One settled possession was ended by a UNC guy pushing Thomson in the crease on a pick.

I know things have played out about as bad as possible these last two 4th quarters, but I truly believe there is nothing fundamentally flawed in our approach late game. I ABSOLUTELY think they can turn around these late performances because our approach is not flawed.

 

[Powellfan]

6. Syracuse
Kinnear’s Vote: 7
Syracuse escaped Chapel Hill with a 10-9 win.

A win is a win in the ACC, but letting UNC back into the game felt like another example of the Orange not having enough discipline late. “We need to be way more composed in fourth quarters,” Gary Gait said afterward.

You won the fight, now move on to fight again. Virginia won’t allow for any mistakes.

Pat March served a one-game suspension after he was kicked out of the Cornell loss.

Whatever your feelings about Syracuse, there is one truth in this sport: There is a spotlight on the Orange that doesn’t exist most places, so this situation got a lot more attention than it would have otherwise. I’m curious how much March’s ejection is addressed in offseason meetings — from the referee assigning process, to appeals to overall sideline decorum toward officials.

https://www.insidelacrosse.com/article/il-staff-s-top-20-what-matters-what-doesn-t/63119

 

[OrangeXtreme]